10.31.07
how else can a government convince their people to go through years of privation and their young men to go out
Netanyahu is a wolf with sheeps clothing.
.. Hmm
Genocide?
It’s all just politics though he’s catering to the hardliners
Your news paper an TV fail translate what Ahmadinejad says!
I preferred sharon and Omert, but the fucking syrians and Iranians complicated matters and hurt prospects for peace between the palestinians and Israelis.
*and
I never cared for Sharon
Genocide couldn’t happen even if someone really wanted it to
Iran is the most evil regime in the world.. Not the people, the regime..
Or Olmert
well its hard to compete with Kim Jung.. But its still true
FreeTra5w, they people like the regime
I support a war with iran..
99 % off the people Dengse Does
No most the people dont like the regime and thats been proven recently in elections
But i am not sure that USA win
go fight
If we invade Iran with a land force it’ll be a bloodbath
the anti regime candidates won by landslides in local elections in some cases the pro regime candidate didnt get a single vote.
You’ll see a nationalistic fervor sweep Iran
bring all your friends and go die
Muhammad is on the Supreme Court Relief..
or kill….y’know….its like the same as IRC except you might get cut
Iran does have a point about the NPT you know
but if you support it, go fight it
I didnt know that till recently, I am ashamed I didnt know that, I pride myself on being knowlegable of such things.
The NPT authorizes peaceful nuclear development
vemo, what are you talkiing about ?
No matter what Condi says
I dont believe in killing, I wouldnt harm a single innocent person who wasnt intent on murder or a murderer or defending a murdering regime.
It would happen though In large scale
What would ?
What I’m saying is in response to you saying “I support a War with Iran”. I’m saying to you…then go fight
deaths of innocents
Jhicks, It authorizes it under th ewtch of the UN and they arent allowing the UN to watch
Have Iran Shahab6?
It’s a voluntary agreement
And trhey arent producing peaceful energy well they are but they are also producing the materials to build nuclear weapons.
Get ‘yo booty over to Iran and kill some people!
It’s not mandatory
If yes why they are testing shahab3?
Or are you more or less a test-tube baby ? Or are you too old ?
Jhicks, Yes but we cant afford to allow people to have nuclear weapons however unfair that might seem and it is unfair. But equality isnt the issue here. Liberty, Freedom and the right of people to no tbe murdered is the issue.
Gordon Prather wrote some informative articles about the NPT, check them out It’s being largely misrepresented
When bad regimes with track records of evil or of supporting murder and terrorism get nuclear weapons only fools would willingly acknowlege they have a right to them
It’s not what Condi, et al says it is
Really stupid fools.
I’m not so sure they aren’t mostly loudmouths
There isn’t a reason for Iran to refine to weapons grade.
because people who support terrorism with nuclear bombs are proven to more likely to use them in a non defensive way
there is no proof they have capacity to do that to a threatening level or will for at least ten years
Logic says you dont give, Hamas, Hezzollah, Iran, Syria, NK, nuclear weapons. IN some places the genie is out of the bad.
I’m not aware that anyone besides Pakistan has proliferated
jhicks, I don’t know where you get the 10 year figure, IAEA found traces of enriched material.
but the real threat of a nuclear accident which is not reversable rises precipitously as people are added to the nuclear club
traces and they may have been planted
FreeTra5w, you just see it from USA’s way
there is no determination of origin
They found highly enriched weapons grade material but in small amounts. trace amounts
jhicks, why would they be planted?
Jhicks, Planted by who ?
smear tactics
that makes no sense
us or israel
Bah
the head investigator is muslim himself.
Dengse….its the only sensible approach
I like to pull out my favourite glove….ummmm which country is the only one to actually use a nuke? atomic bomb
i don’t doubt for one second that israel could have planted those trace amounts
VemoD…apples & oranges
and has motive
are you suggesting that Al-Baredei would cover up for Iran?
jhicks, Israel huh, like they can get in there?
VemoD, the USA defensively in WW2 againstJapan, and if I had been Truman I would not of done it.. I dont think.
They’re all over the place in Iran They’ve been caught there
But what is the liklihood we would use it again ? Almost mil..
nil
And This is a new world from then, I dont see a comparison.
now what would be the likelihood of Iran using a nuke?
so, if everyone else could be the “world police” wouldn’t it follow that the US shouldn’t be allowed to own this type of weapon?
I’m a bit more worried about Russian nukes
I now a bit Iranish, and i now that your newspaper dont translate the true off what Ahmadinejad says
that actually exist
jhicks…and the russians Dengse…wrong…..dead wrong
If another countries constitution was based on the most liberal freedoms like the USA, was the worlds superpower, and 3rd largest population (Or 4th), And the people of htis country and their government was very pro peace, they would have this right to take out place
heh dertmas
We for example know from history we can trust the UK with Nukes.
Dengse, they translate fine.
?
I predict that Iran will eventually acquire nuclear weapons And not much will be done about it
No they dont
jhicks..and when will they fire one at Tel-Aviv?
See the way that I think about it, is kids in the sandbox. Everyones got the same weapons. The baddest and biggest kid wins I guess. Thats humanity, thats the ugly side of humanity that people don’t want to except….but its the truth.
They cheat you
never, that would guarantee anhilation anihilation even
All off you where look at those news papers learn persian and hear what he says
the US is the biggest kid in the sand box…but also the best behaved
We know from the history of England that they are not an agressor nation anymore.. even when they were colonialist they thought they were helping people of course that wasnt the case in India or Palestine their last 2 occupied areas.
bleh
jhicks…the Q’uran does not believe in that
I believe the mullahs will pass
And so you take the reputation of a nation over many years and you look at the charter of that nation..
Iran will become a secular nation
hicks..they need to be thron down
By the Iranians nothing else will work
You look at things like Magna Carta to see what they think of issues of liberty and freedom, or the Constitution. and you look at the nature of the people and the history of the people
But if the US keep acting like an asshole, some of the others might not really back him up so much. We can’t control the world, just like you can’t control a sandbox or an IRC chatroom and what people might say
We dont want war in the world, I dont know any americans who do. we want peace, we could go much futher to try to force peace, but we use our power when it becomes justifiable. likein Serbia (Which was in my mind questionable) but I understood.. Now Iraq is much more of a threat to the USA or was than serbia ever was. serbia threatened the stability of europe
I know Americans who want war with the world
and the main fears were mass immigration to european countries. so they asked us to come fight for them
CemoD…alas…when Europe will not step up to the plate to deal with amtters Odious, we have to
we did
In the defense industry primarily
Dont belive your news papers
then when a country which delcared us an enemy, Iraq, when we go to war with an enemy Europe says, NO! accept the good European countries who joined us. France Belhium and Germany were the main exceptions.. Ironic considering ww2
The Middle East needs a “Monroe Doctrine”
Dengse…this froma country that has culture riots over some stupid cartoons because they can not be bothered with assimilation or integration?
What if ummm….Japan all of a sudden got in an argument with austrailia?
What I am speaking about was not in any newspaper it is reality
VemoD…they did once..
Who’s Been Naughty and Nice?
Vemo, Japan today and Australia would work it out through diplomacy or through mediation
Muhammed Ali is a baaaad man
they are both very peaceful nations. They are not a threat
Osama gets a gift too…a MOAB with a ribbon on it
It only takes one nutjob leader to turn all that around FT
SO fidel has colon cancer.
jhicks..one Khomeini…
Ok, so is the US a peaceful nation?
One Bush
I wonder if his brother will liberate it.
Fiddledick is not gonna live long
some of his statements lately are very encouraging
good riddance wrt Fidel
VemoD….yes
He’s less of a communist than a general asshole
CryHavoc, hmm
Vemo, Americans love peace more than anyone in the world.
Then why are we waging wars?
I love peace I want peace more than anyting
and yer safer here then aywhere else in the world
Not more than the swedish
more than money more than oil. I want peace..
Not more than the Swiss
But I believe sometimes war is neccesary to achieve peace
consider our size Hicks..
I would fix that! hehe
you need cops to control neighborhood violence.
and we have more religious freedom then the Swiss too
you need a military to stop international bullies sometimes.
lefties don’t get the same kick out of predictability
And America has the answer to peace is what you think?
I wish we ddint need cops or a military
Not a defined constitutional role of our govt
how mush wealthier we would all be but people and nations dont act rigth on thier own..
VemoD…Europe is not
Show me a new way of looking at cartoons. Or anthropology. Or hell, just make me laugh.
Most do
We could do with a LOT less
but most isnt enough
We could do with HALF as much as we have easily
all must or you need cops, and military
Do you ever think how insignificant this idea is?
It’s big govt
Ok belive your news papers, but they dosnt tell the true
at its worst
I mean…you’ve studied history right?
Dengse…yours sure do not…
Vemo, Palestinians and israelis who want peace believe that without the USA is impossible
Freedom is never free
Our papers don’t all agree
they believe we have to be involved for it to happen
neither do our citizens
Give me something to think about.0
and not because we control Israel, Noone controls Israel only fools think anyone controls Israel we may have influence but not control
Israel controls us, not us controlling them!
If you want peace, you’ll have to find that spiritually imo. Buddah and Christ sought peace…..
VemoD– What is free for that matter?
Vemo, The expression freedom is never free comes from the military its most used in a military context
AIPAC has lost some measure of influence however
Neither were American, neither were close to this century Its been going on forever….the quest for peace
Vemo, what country you from ? I want your opinion of ww2
Same as you
and americas role in ww2
I’m not aware that the US has lobbyist organizations around the Knesset?
oh then you cant know. nevermind. OD you have any clue how much they relied on “the Americans” in ww1 and 2, not just for our fighting ability which wasnt that great initially, but the faith they had in us if we came and helped.
The guy that promises to bring eternal peace is the guy you’d better beware of… He’s a con artist most likely, of the worst form
Over here over there.. They had a popular song in ww1 which was like a prayer almost for America to come.
CryHavoc, i heard what he says i dont care what the news paper say
There hope their lives rested on faith that Americans would come..
All of Europe was involved in WW2 for starters
That friggin Wilson!
Western Europe in both world wars depended on the U.S.
But i know that your news papers is too subjektivb
Asia was involved
*subjektive
Jhicks, yeah that was a very unfortunate war which didnt need to happen and the truth is two major causes of the war were both against the war.
The way that WWI happened was due in large part to bad communications prevalent of the day
the czar and the kaiser
It was more than that
If we had cell phones back then it would not have happened.
All these big plans, once set into motion, etc
jhicks.,..and a 19th century mindset
A militaristic mindset
and Africa…..
I believe the British MP was at sea on vacation yachting or something I forget..but he was out of communication
Plus, there was a clear cut case of a Tyrant. I mean, it was obvious who the enemy was, what the objective was, and how to take care of it.
jhicks — WWI has a war waiting to happen. It took very little to start it
a predisposition toward conflict
and the sundering of the german provinces after Napoleon
shit rain in N.Cal
I had to study WW I a lot
Well, France was jealous over Germany’s colonial holdings somewhat
FT..ewww…its raining shit?
They say the mountains are going to be pummeled with snow, and 2 weeks ago I listened on KCBS to a woman who was talking about how almost immediatley california would be losing all of its snow because of global warming.
France and England wanted the middle eastern colonies more than any of Germany’s poor African colonies.
diahrrea or hard nuggets?
yeah
God what idiots… KCBS for allowing these nuts on
You like peace, but I think you objectify war to your own pizza toppings
The Ottomans had to go etc
‘yknow….you wanna be part of something big I guess
Gromit..not the point..UK and France grabbed most of Africa
guess what, this war is bumkiss
They did that before WWI.
Germany Spain Portugal and belgium got scraps
friggin belgium
vemo, You have not the slightest clue of how complex my thinking is, I would love to have you sit down with me and go through it all in detail with speech rather than typing. But there are advantages and disadvantages to irc…
The Ottoman and Austrian-Hungarian Empires were falling apart on their own
this created an undercurrent of resentment in Germany
But you could see the passion in my face for peace.. And see how much I really believe in it.
give isolationism a chance! just two years!
AAA the Ottman empire was…but not the nabsburgs
well happy kwanza!
And I dont justify it for supeficial reasons, I am very well educated in whats going on in the world and geo politics where conflict is.
aw cmon man
Kwanzaa is a crock
I know what the Iranian Regime has done, and is doing
kwaanza?
Well the next time I go to Cali….
let them feel the cold of night without US handouts
invented Holiday
that was a joke
I know how they are the #1 world sponser of terrorism and were even before Iraq
all holidays are invented
But Iraq was a more compelling target.
Yeah,
Hapsburg were falling apart as nationalism was starting up
Christmas has no meaning now.
like president’s day
Kwanzaa was conjured out of the blue….
We did Iran a huge favor bumbling into Iraq
whatever happend to lincoln’s birthday?
Iran is more complicated and ultimatley we may need to have war. I wish we didnt.
Smas corresponds to the Winter solstice
yes
God I wish we didnt.
I see no reason for war with Iran
Easter Spring solstice
It’s not inevitable FreeTra5w
I would do anything if the people of Iran would rise up and take control of thier government, the people of Iran want peace too.
Kwanzaa was a PC invention
Hey Trap!
AAAman, that depends on Iran
easter is timely, but christmas was made to coincide with the solstice hey freetrade
That depends on anything at anytime too
Aaaman, You dont see. Blind men see nothing
merry christmas to you and the family!
so of course they see no reasons
There isn’t going to be war with Iran It’s not necessary And we can’t afford it
Why war with Iran?
actually, jesus was killed during passover
AAA, how about wiping out Israel and palestinians , I dont see how palestinians can live in a radioactive wasteland either.
so we have a date to work with at least in the jewish calendar
Jhicks, if Iran doesnt ultimately come around, we will have war
Iran doesn’t have nuclear weapons.
bank on it if not us, israel.
but as far as christmas is concerned……
Its going to happen, but it can be stopped if Iran will stop
Israel can protect itself.
War with Iran will raise price of oil and probably push a good part of the war into an economic depression
ummmm no war with iran pass it on
nope no war
us has no combat troops available
or if there is by some miracle a spontaneous revolution within Iran, the people of Iran are already showing extreme unhappiness with thier government..
and nobody else is really interested
they don tlike it
Russia will become filfthy rich selling oil at $200 barrel
its equipment is in terrible shape its soldiers too
they believe they will die off soon, but they dont have enough time for them to die off..
very true
the crisis is coming in years not decades
the students are grumbling
Israel has more problems with demographics than nukes
Mongo, yep…
FreeTra5w is unhappy with Iranian Govt. Are there anyother Govts that do not meet your standards?
Jhicks, no they dont, they dont have demographic problems, explain ?
In about fifty years they will outnumbered IN Israel
and rafsanjani’s election appears to show dussatisfasction with the President and his party
You mean when arabs out breed jews ? Like in 200 years ? The straightline graphs never are accurate
nah
hmm… maybe AAAman is happy with a government run by known terrorists…
It’s forecast (by Israel) to be less
right now israel is 75% jewish
By now America should be all non white, but its still 70% white or so..
and the sephardim are big breeders
BillFrugg — Terrorists are much closer to taking over atomic Pakistan — something really to worry about
with a rapidly declining birthrate overall
the ashkenazi aren’t
ashkenzim are the greater of the population
yeah, but not for long
BillFrugg– Iran was our ally in fighting terrorism in Afghanistan, short memory
Not true, jhicks.
AAAman, they’re not an ally…
It’s about half and half. A lot of ashkenazim are old, too.
although i might do my duty and impregnate as many askenazi females as i can mext time3 i go to israel
haha
BillFrugg — In this matter they were
you go boy!
Mongo, I will help. As long they are female the offspring are still jewish ;0
AAAman, things change, and they have since Afghanistan
yup good thinking
hahaha
I’ll tell your wife!
i’ll meet you there
don’t think we live in a static world
Well Ok, you got me ! I wont
get 2bar to hjoin us
haha NO!
BillFrugg– They elected these idiots, proving the value of elections and democracy
plz donut spread those geens
heh 2bar is ok i like him
i know
he is a good guy
AAAman, you know nothing about Iran
but we just need ONE k?
But the point is demographic fears are usually based on straight line trends which just rarely stay straigt line, so they are deceptive predictors.
there is no democracy in Iran
BillFrugg– We just do not start wars against people who we do not like BillFrugg– educate me
actually there is as much as there is anywhere
Bill, there is some local democracy
It’s apparently enough of a concern that the Knesset and several Uni’s expressed alarm
the elections are relatively fair
The problem is at the national election level they disqualify anyone they thing is a threat to the mullahs.
you are woefully ignorant
even in the US candidates are vetted by their party before they are nominated
thing =think
I have friends from Iran
so do i
Bill, The local elections are fairly accurate hey comet!
poor billary
but maybe you know things i don’t, so tell me
jeeze, edwards is a kook, too
FreeTrade )
surely you knew that before
her ratings are worse than bush’s!
have a couple of minutes to pop in
doug, you just figure that out?
Edwards has come up very fast, but I dont think Iowa really makes a difference anymore.
my house is a wreck .. kids everywhere .. hehe
ok, not by much but whatever
Dean crashed and burned there.
oh, It was clear in the 04 campaign.
I’m loving every minute of it !!!
Hilary is now ahead of McCain and Rudie in the polls
Rather he did well there and then crashed and burned
I didn’t receive my gifts yet, did you use FedEx?
hillary’s numbers fell a LOT these last few weeks but
lol
she has a LOT of campaign money
AAAman thats the opposite of what I heard. She is 4th
AAAman, well you know right now i wouldnt beging to predict elections.. Even I who love to predict
DONT tell me you shipped them UPS!
n/m thought you meant just dems
That topic could be completely different in a week.
lol
Hillary nationally is way ahead
hehe
FreeTrade no joke
Yep..
i heard edwards came in 3rd actually
but we have to enjoy it while it lasts
Merry Christmas people, I’m going to get some aig nawg
but i didn’t see anything
Right now its just like testing the waters, putting the toes in, and things will change a lot in a year..
just heard something on TV oh wait sorry i heard about new hampshire not iowa
You know some major event, in 2 years is very likely to happen.
http://home.earthlink.net/~hvoigt/images/H-and-P-Xmas.jpg
you realize that hampshire is a word that derives from cannabis
The top three candidates were Sen. John Edwards at 22 percent, Democratic U.S. Sen. Barrack Obama at 22 percent and Vilsack at 12 percent. U.S. Senator Hillary Clinton of New York came in fourth at 10 percent.
actually i didn’t, but it sounds right
it is
terrorist attack.. War (Maybe 2 other countries), Complete reversal of fortunes in Iraq, Coup in iran, democratic congress percieved poorly, we just dont know..
pigs fly
well you never know all things considered, anything is possible in the next 2 years
But its almost sure by probability something major will happen which could drastically change the politics.
a giant asteroid impacts Paris
The political lanscape
does it really matter that much?
but i doubt there will be another war
hey mrRod
Hey!
vemo does what matter much ?
let’s hope not, we’re basically screwed already because of Iraq
actually that is more likely than a war
hehe
Their govt.
But not only possible probable that a major even of some sort will happpenin th enext 2 years
damned
we really don’t have the means to attack anyone else for a while
Illinois Sen. Barack Obama surged from nowhere yesterday into a tie with former Sen. John Edwards in a presidential poll of Iowa Democrat
talked to myself again
I am NOT in favor of the USA blowing $100 TRILLION dollars in the Middle East
If the 2008 Republican Caucus were held today, Republican U.S. Sen. John McCain would be the top vote-getter, with 27 percent of Iowa Republicans polled saying they would pick him. Republican Rudy Guiliani was second with 26 percent, and Republican Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney was third with only 9 percent of votes overall.
Its amazing we havent had a terrorist attack yet of much size..
$100 BILLION a year hell
bud“– That is statistical dead heat
that’s more than i make!
I’m speaking of the costs of a ‘generational committment’
well
both direct and indirect over say, 100 years
generational commitment is a phrase
Condi likes to use it a lot
I mean Cuba is communist and they are a small little place that is really close. Couldn’t we just take them over in the name of “world peace”?
it doesn’t necessarily mean the kind of effort we are currently making
Vemo, we wont have to, I bet in 2 years they are no longer communist
The Middle East could be the destruction of our republic
without us doing a thing
Maybe it’s not entirely surprising. For example, look at the attack on the London subway. The British were more vunerable because they’ve allowed radical Islamic people into Britian. The US doesn’t have anywhere near the problem the British have had. Same with other European countries.
well, she is doing as asked by her boss
Security Council Approves Sanctions Against Iran Over Nuclear Program
See, there is something more…Cuba has no monetary reason
i cannot blame her for what she says
true boot lickers
weaker than proposals in earlier drafts after repeated changes intended to placate Russia.
I don’t think the US is as vunerable as Europe. Not that we’re invunerable.
george w bush is known to prize loyalty above even competance
God, I’m having deja vu of LBJ all over again
competence? sp?
the second one
We aren’t spending all of this money and sacrificing human lives for “world peace” or democracy or whatever you think is the best form of govt.
MrRod, I definately agree with you, and the likelihood now for a major attack has gone way down, but w2e have blocked a lot of attacks if you believe intelligence sources and I do in this case becxause it sounds reasonable and we have arrests, but i think we should see some smaller terrorist attacks succeed soon.
well lbj did realize he was wrong, but it took him a while
Another example is France. The French have a large population of Muslims who are marginalized. Muslums in the US tend to be middle class and not radical. They don’t provide a base of support for radicals. That’s not true in Britian or France.
he knew he was wrong from the moment he lied about tonkin
Iran has the right under the 1970 nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty to produce nuclear energy as long as it forswears the pursuit of nuclear warheads.
or even before
But I agree definately that our risk is smaller than europes, however if one well organized or state spondsered event does happen here it could be devestating..
Because we aren’t invading China
but I would lay odds more on a 100 dead ]or 25 dead or 10 dead
But China can fight back!
or maybe not so long….there are tapes of his conversations with senator russell long in which he said that he knew we were not gonna win
Or Cuba
what a bastard
Vemp, Why would we invade china out economic partner ?
When do we hit Iran with an oil embargo
We depend on each other a lot..
yes, i would agree
And we have no reason to want a conflict with China.
An important vunerability is when a country has a Muslim population that is willing to provide support to terrorists.
Well thats what I’m getting at. People are dying for money
shit, you mean we won’t sell iran any oil? that’ll show them!
Vemo huh ?
hehehe
What ? Dying for money ?
mongo — Refuse to buy their oil
we don’t
What the hell are you talking about ?
we can’t “trading with the enemy act”
If we’d just develop that energy source tesla kept going on about we wouldn’t need oil!
mongo — By us, I mean the UN
You sound like n00b!
Your telling me that if Cuba is capitalist in 2 years because Fidel is dead that its about money ?
YOU TAKE THAT BACK YOU SISSY!!
the UN wouldn’t do that
I think its about freedom
and even if they did, it would notbe complied with
I sure go to the heart of the matter, don’t I?
The world needs oil!
like a piercing arrow thwunk!
people won’t cut of their noses to spite their faces yes it does
Sometimes people do.
Tesla did come up with some neat shit however
Within limitations, Iran can do what it wants
the world needs oil
Vemo you lost me somewhere
not rational people
True. But many people are irrational.
i agree
And to view an artists rendition of the Van Allen belts impresses one with the energy all around us There has to be a way to get at it
just look at the sun come up every morning, if you need to be reminded of energy around us
Oil speaks all too loudly
There’s energy all around us. A lot of energy. The only difficulty is converting it into something useful.
Vemo, if you believe the war in iraq is for money for the USA I consider you must uninformed and maybe nuts.
You lost me
before the wheel was invented there were no corvettes
We are spending enough money there to put in oil reserves for decades We are not making money by war thats simply false
Its for a global economy
Semiconductors are amazing
you could set an example by putting a lump of coal in your gas tank of your car
its a age old conspiracy
FreeTra5w– There is no clear cut reason for Iraq war.
economy = money if my dictionary
Just meaning that, human invention is a pretty cool thing and amazing advances are possible
Its not for world peace
Aaaman there are many, You may disagree with the reasons but there are many
well look
FreeTra5w-Thus you agree there is no clear cut reason
whatever the reasons were for the iraq war, and whether they were “good” reasons or not, that is the past
Our embroilment in the middle east is about israel, that is it and that is all
Vemo, the hell it isnt, its to stabilize, the middle east so we dont have to wonder what Saddam is doing in his basement.
we are now in the present so why argue about that has been done?
The war in Iraq IS about money. It’s about protecting US interests abroad, which really gets down to economics. If Saddam was a central African dictator who threatened his neighbors and tortured his countrymen I don’t think the US would have done anything significant. The fact that Iraq is in the middle east is an important factor.
But, the thing is is the US will make sure it is the banker of this global economy
look we know SADDAM was an evil man who murdered 10k people without blinking
Right but there are lotsa evil people we don’t do shit about
so was stalin
Look at Tony Blair! ahem
you think he would have any problem reprocessing plutonium for a dirty bomb for AL QUEDA or would have any reservations at all about harming amrericans ?
MrRod — I disagree — We have yet to learn the motivation behind starting the war
He attacked 5 of his neighbors why would nbhe leave america alone..
Regional problem, not our concern
would you gain by the info, if you learned it?
The thing I really don’t get, is how history can be so easily forgotten.
seriously?
The only difference is he couldnt hit america overtly he would have to do it in a sneaky covert way and pray he didnt get caught.
What did the US do in Rwanda? Or Darfur? Or Chad? Or any of a number of screwed up African countries? Nothing significant. They aren’t important to US interests.
but he could and probably would have done something eventually
We are supposed to learn from history, not repeat it
uganda under idi amin
We already give plenty of money to regional powers to assist with their defense
The Romans tried the same thing
Vemo, the history of Saddam ?\ i AGREE, HOW can it be forgotten so easily
back further
MrRod — People say GWB only wanted to finish his father’s war. I have no idea if this is true
that he was a belligerent leader who was warlike and a bully since he was a child in tikrit a guy who enjoyed attacking other people.. other countries..
I don’t believe the thing about babies getting bayoneted in their incubators either
a guy who was a megalomanic on top of all that..
it might be, but i think there were other reassons that are not usually mentioned in conversation
Saddam would not have bothered the US if we left him alone to invade Kuwait and, possibly, Saudi Arabia. The fact that we cannot allow someone like Saddam to control a vital oil-producting region is the reason we had a conflict with him.
That was PURE propaganda
A man who studied hITLER as a great man
Just like the attempted assassination of GHWB in Kuwait was
MrRod, Would be allow him to destroy Israel who has no oil
ever hear the propaganda by the allies in wwI? about how the germans bayonetted belgian infants in their cribs?
or Jordan ?
put it this way….you said you wanted peace. You don’t reach peace by killing people
murder of babies seems to be a recurring theme
propaganda is normal during wars
yeah
If you don’t understand that, I don’t know what else to say
or to incite them
MrRod, ill be you a million dollars which I caqn never pay becuase you can never prove a negative but I am so sure of it, that if he has attacked Jordan or Israel which have no monetary consequence to us, We would have gone to war with him too.
violence begets violence
true
They are allies. So, no. My point is that the fact that Saddam killed and tortured his countrymen is not the reason we had a conflict with Iraq. It’s the importance of the region. Israel is also important to the US.
It happens that for monetary reasons he was interested in Kuwait and Saudi Arabia
Wait until the traumatized children of Iraq grow up
how else can a government convince their people to go through years of privation, and their young men to go out and kill people, and very likely get killed themselves?
Israel is well able to defend itself
they can’t! which is why propaganda is so repugnant
yeah it is
Peace can be attained by making your enemy believe that a fight would leave him fubar’d… and sometimes it can be attained by kicking the holy hell out of your enemy until the fucker stops getting back up for more.
but it is very comon
oh indeed
Aaaman, ? Thats what they thought until they fought hezbollah, now they are not so sure..
and very effective as well
the catholic church has a department of propaganda
sheeple
Now without saturation bombing all the people of lebanon.
i am not knocking the church
Every large organization does.
just demonstrating how propaganda is everywhere
Peace through the threat of and/or use of force isn’t just plausible, it’s time tested and mother-approved.
“Director of Communications” etc
The point is we would have fought iraq if they had taken over morrocco, Jordan, Israel, Egypt, ALL kinds of country without much oil.
I was always a good kid. I never got into trouble.
that really sounds like comething george orwell might have written
Uhm
Of course we didnt want Them to control the majority of the oil in the middle east.
mongo… I’ll take that as a compliment.
Since when was Iraq aiming at Morroco?
“peace through war”
You do realize where Morroco is, right?
FreeTra5w– Iran was more to lose
i wasn’t criticizing you, just commenting on the content of what you said
FreeTra5w– Iran has more to lose then terrorists
but we could have also said to saddam go for it man.. Take it all we back you, Just give us some juice.. And we could have bought oil from Saddam.
“putting out fire with water” omfglolbbq
mmm bbq
Jhicks, Shut the fuck up
One-liners don’t really get ya out of the debate on this one.
roflcopter
I realize where it is
hehe FT
We typically don’t get involved in bloody conflicts in Africa, even when one country is attacking another. Currently Ethiopia and Somolia are fighting (yet again…). There’s no talk of US troops being sent in. Won’t happen.
us no longer has a dept of war, we have a “defense dept”
It’s a bit more complex than oxymoron fun.
the point I am making is its a sovereign nation without a ton of oil and we would have protected it too.. thats my point Its an arab country
mongo… propaganda, ain’t it great?
I’m just pissed because we don’t have and decent hash from our assistance to Afghanistan
israel doesn’t have an army
Same with Jordan no oil
